Linkin Park/REM/Radiohead Smackdown!

[Josh]

For those interested, REM HQ is revealing the track listing for the upcoming REM Best Of project, publishing one new title every day. They're up to #6, and, so far, the selections aren't bad. I'm pleasantly surprised to see "Kenneth" and "Reno" made the cut, though, if I had to narrow down the REM canon to 18 tracks, the latter wouldn't make my list.

Now let's all pray that "E-Bow" makes the list. For some reason, they haven't been playing that one live as much. GRRRR!

Oh, and... awwwwww, how sweet!

[DvChWi]

This has been bothering me for some time.  Maybe you can help me out with this.  Whats with Thom's left eye?  Every picture of him I've seen, its always kind of closed.  It makes people I know who don't like Radiohead call him "creepy".

[Josh]

Beats me. Just a bad eye, I suppose...  =)  

[bloop]

It's a genetic abnormality.

*edit*

The story from allmusic

Born October 7, 1968, in Wellingborough, England, Yorke was born with a vision ailment: his left eye was paralyzed and shut and until the age of six, underwent a total of five operations. The last operation was botched and he almost lost all sight out of that eye (only after wearing an eye patch for a year was he able to see, albeit slightly).

There you go.

Goodness, those two should cut a project together.  It could be soooo good.

[Josh]

Goodness, those two should cut a project together. It could be soooo good.

YES!

I assume you've heard about the two of them singing together at recent concerts? The two bands were both in the same city (Vancouver, I think?) for a couple of days and, at REM's concert, Stipe joined them to sing "Karma Police," and the next night Thom joined REM to sing "E-Bow the Letter." That last one would sound absolutely AMAZING with Thom singing Patti Smith's part. Mmmmmmmmmm...

[bloop]

01 Man on the Moon
02 The Great Beyond [from Man on the Moon soundtrack]
03 Bad Day [previously unreleased]
04 What's The Frequency, Kenneth?
05 All The Way To Reno (You're Gonna Be A Star)
06 Losing My Religion
07 E-Bow The Letter
08 Orange Crush
09 Imitation of Life
10 Daysleeper
11 Animal [previously unreleased]
12 The Sidewinder Sleeps Tonite
13 Stand
14 Electrolite
15 All The Right Friends [from Vanilla Sky soundtrack]
16 Everybody Hurts
17 At My Most Beautiful
18 Nightswimming

Not bad, but where's "Drive"?  "Bittersweet Me"?  "Radio-free Europe"?  I like ALL of these more than "Stand".  U2 made two best-of albums, and I think REM has enough material to do the same if they really wanted to do so (80s and 90s-00s).  

Overall, though, very strong track list.  REM is in the league of "great ones" . . . U2, REM, the Smiths, Sonic Youth being the big 4 of the bands that started in the 80s (that I know well, of course).  (Having my personal favorite band as their students doesn't hurt my view of them, either).  This should be a great introduction to the band for the young 'uns.

[Josh]

Wait...

This is supposed to be the best of 1990-2003.

So...WHY IS "STAND" ON THERE?!?

And "Sidewinder"? Weird. I would have gone with "Drive," "Find the River," or, better yet, another track from Reveal over that one.

[Josh]

Oh, no, it's 88-03, so "Stand" can stay. And "Orange Crush."

[bloop]

Oh, then definitely strike "Radio-free Europe".

I agree with you that "Drive" should have a place.  I think I like "Automatic..." a tad more than you.  I also think that Reveal is represented well enough.

[RokrantheGreat]

[bloop]

[DvChWi]

That's their happy face.

Yes, thats the happiest I've ever seen Thom in any picture.  Don't really know R.E.M., but this could be a cool best of to check out.  

[Josh]

Really, I'm pretty happy with the tracklisting. Such projects never make everyone totally happy, and this collection doesn't have any major blunders like last year's U2 compilation did. Sure, I'd change a few things, but, all in all, this looks like a solid set.

[bloop]

Yes, thats the happiest I've ever seen Thom in any picture.

Well, there is this picture to contend with

http://www.greenplastic.com/multimedia/gal...hom/thom027.jpg

*edit*  forget it, I'll just put up the link.  Greenplastic probably blocks this kind of thing.

[DvChWi]

Well, there is this picture to contend with

Can't see it.
[EDIT]Never mind, found it manually and fixed it for you.
[EDIT]Can't see it anymore!  Whats going on??  It worked before. :angry:  

[RokrantheGreat]

[bloop]

[DvChWi]

[RokrantheGreat]

You can't win!  You've already resorted to taking cheap shots at the looks of the lead singers of these bands!  You don't have anything better! HAHA!

So? All you guys can come up with is how LP doesn't have any "rough edges" and is too "poppy." Or that they try to cater (sp?) to their listeners tastes, instead of trying to be "original" (read: weird) and "artistic" (read: weird, also). Not saying that being original and new is bad, just that staying with a sure thing (LP has sold millions of CD's) with just a little tweaking and originality is ok, too.  

[bloop]

My main criticism:  their songs are all the same - that angsty teen thing that I tend to despise.  At least Radiohead gets upset at real problems.

[DvChWi]

Not saying that being original and new is bad, just that staying with a sure thing (LP has sold millions of CD's) with just a little tweaking and originality is ok, too.

Selling millions means nothing as far as overall quality goes.  And the problem isn't the "no rough edges" or even that they are to "poppy", more than the fact they sound the same more or less in all their songs. Reanimation is my favorite LP cd just because its a little different then the others, and has some pretty interesting electronic stuff, at times.  Now, I'm sure there are other bands who do this type of thing better, but its just what I'm familiar with.  And who said original means weird?  There are lots of original bands that I wouldn't consider even remotely weird.  

[RokrantheGreat]

[bloop]

To answer your question, no, in the long run, some dime a dozen chick choosing Ben & Jerry's and chick flicks over you for her evening's entertainment is not a real problem.

[DvChWi]

So teen problems aren't real problems  :angry: ?

Eh, teens do have problems, but LP just sings about general angst and anger and stuff, rather than addressing specific issues.  They aren't specific enough.  And, in the grand scheme of things, teen problems aren't that big.  Just wait until we have to go out and get our own house and food and  stuff.  It will be then that the real problems start.  We will wish we only had problems like we do now.  Or so I imagine.  I admit, Radiohead is a little weird, but there are many other original bands that aren't remotely weird.

[bloop]

There's also the problem that Linkin Park AREN'T TEENAGERS.  Hello?  Write music that's true for yourself.  If their development is arrested at 17 years of age, then I guess I understand.

Um, what's the topic again?  Oh yeah, REM.  They aren't that weird (generally, not as much as Radiohead), and their music and songwriting is very original.  Case in point.

[DvChWi]

[RokrantheGreat]

Yes, Radiohead addresses all those important issues, like Unborn Chicken Voices. One of the world's greatest problems today. I'd rather worry about angst.  

REM isn't weird, just too slow . Radiohead is most definitely weird, tho.

[oneafroboy]

On the side of LP (not my favorite group, but I like spinning their CDs around once in awhile), I don't think their songs sound all the same. I mean, they don't have the diversity of the Beatles, but who does? (Yes, I'm obsessed!!!!   )

I think they deal with raw emotions rather than specific issues. I don't know. I don't think that's bad. I think a mix of both is good, but sometimes, I know I feel like a pile of emotions--and sometimes I don't have a clue why I feel the way I do. I just am. I think they do a good job of conveying emotions. Only thing is I can't listen to them too much. They tend to only convey the dark emotions, anger and depression, and that really eats away at me. I prefer other kinds of music, but LP isn't awful, guys. Kudos, RokrantheGreat, for bringing diversity to the board and liking a band not looked upon highly here.  

Oh, and I know nothing about REM. So, I can't compare 'em. But I'll have to check 'em out soon.  

[DvChWi]

For the record, I don't think LP is bad, I just don't think they are that good.

[Josh]

REM isn't weird, just too slow

Seems to me that the problem here is with your attention span rather than with the band in question.    But seriously, I understand that there are times when slower music isn't as appealing, but this isn't a fair criticism against REM, because a) they don't always play at a slow tempo; you obviously haven't heard much of their music, and B) there's nothing wrong with slow-paced music.

As for Linkin Park, I don't like them; they don't puch themselves to try new things like U2 and REM do. Their music is empty of real invention and art. But I'm not too interested in bashing them; I came here to talk about REM.  [_[  

[DvChWi]

But I'm not too interested in bashing them; I came here to talk about REM.  [_[

Hey, he started by calling Stipes and Yorke ugly!  The truth is, I don't know enough about R.E.M. to have any real discussion about them.  We can talk about Automatic for the People, but beyond that, I'm lost.  Thats why I think this best of thing will be cool.  Do they mostly sound like they do on Automatic, or are all their albums pretty different from each other?

[RokrantheGreat]

On the side of LP (not my favorite group, but I like spinning their CDs around once in awhile), I don't think their songs sound all the same. I mean, they don't have the diversity of the Beatles, but who does? (Yes, I'm obsessed!!!!   )

I think they deal with raw emotions rather than specific issues. I don't know. I don't think that's bad. I think a mix of both is good, but sometimes, I know I feel like a pile of emotions--and sometimes I don't have a clue why I feel the way I do. I just am. I think they do a good job of conveying emotions. Only thing is I can't listen to them too much. They tend to only convey the dark emotions, anger and depression, and that really eats away at me. I prefer other kinds of music, but LP isn't awful, guys. Kudos, RokrantheGreat, for bringing diversity to the board and liking a band not looked upon highly here.  

Oh, and I know nothing about REM. So, I can't compare 'em. But I'll have to check 'em out soon.

Thank you very much. That's much of what I've been trying to say, just put in better words (I'm terrible at debating).

But seriously, I understand that there are times when slower music isn't as appealing, but this isn't a fair criticism against REM, because a) they don't always play at a slow tempo; you obviously haven't heard much of their music, and  there's nothing wrong with slow-paced music.

I wasn't criticizing REM, exactly. Just saying that that's my impression of them and I like faster music. I've only heard "Murmurs," tho, so maybe they have better albums, I don't know. I agree, there's nothing wrong with slow music, I just don't usually like it.
 

[Josh]

Do they mostly sound like they do on Automatic, or are all their albums pretty different from each other?

They sound totally different on each album. Like U2, they work hard at not repeating themselves.

Most fans consider Automatic to be their best work, and I think bloop is one of them, but my personal favorites are Reveal and New Adventures in Hi Fi, which both sound totally unlike Automatic.

[bloop]

"New Adventures..." is my favorite REM album.  "Automatic..." is second place, to me.  "Reveal..." right up there with "Automatic..." some days with me.

Oh, and good one, Rokran, taking a specific phrase of a Radiohead song out of context to make your point.  The song isn't about chicken voices, and the basic problem addressed by that particular song is more important, universally-speaking, than whatever vague personal emotion Linkin Park tries to elicit.  Kudos indeed.

btw, does anyone remember a LP article where they said, basically, that the band failed to even convey the emotions they were going for on Hybrid Theory...something about them wanting to be positive.  I don't remember where I read that...I think in "Rolling Stone".

[RokrantheGreat]

Oh, and good one, Rokran, taking a specific phrase of a Radiohead song out of context to make your point.  The song isn't about chicken voices, and the basic problem addressed by that particular song is more important, universally-speaking, than whatever vague personal emotion Linkin Park tries to elicit.  Kudos indeed.

 

Ok, but you forgot one important thing. What's the song talking about?  

[Skrappybiskit]

Just the fact that Radiohead manages to be poetic with their angst and whatever else, wheras Linkin Park is always screaming about "all the pain inside" and "all the pain within" and "it doesn't even matter", proves the point. Linkin Park does their thing, which is angry-white-boy music, or actually whimpering-white-mamas-boy music, and Radiohead does their thing.

You could talk for maybe 5 minutes about Linkin Park songs. Even fanboys have a hardtimedoingthat. But Radiohead... could talk forever!

I still don't like U2.

Skraps

[DvChWi]

I still don't like U2.
 

What? You didn't change your mind since your other post?  Weird.  

 

[bloop]

Ok, but you forgot one important thing. What's the song talking about?

Well, since it was actually written as three different songs that they decided to join, the operative question is "what are the songs about?"  I don't make it a habit to spill everything when it comes to matters of interpretation (which is something that is an abiding need to understand Radiohead's lyrics - the knowlege that it demands interpretation), but I'll give a good nudge.  

The thread binding the three songs, in my estimation, is the newly powerful in the modern, digital-age society, and their effect on that society.  I could be totally off-base, but that's one of the things I appreciate about this band more than many others:  they require a little bit of extra thought.  Someone else might have a different interpretation, but I doubt any of them will see chickens as an integral part of their idea.

Thom Yorke says that it's about the fall of the Roman empire, but I'm not catching that.  That's the only band interpretation I could find.  

Linkin Park's music is pretty easily understood, so I guess it appeals to people on a different level than I like.  I still think it's not even debatable which has been more important to music as an art form in the past 10 years.

[Josh]

I agree with the pholks who said that Radiohead's music is more challenging and more rewarding when discussed; both are marks of truly great bands.

[RokrantheGreat]

Linkin Park's music is pretty easily understood, so I guess it appeals to people on a different level than I like.  I still think it's not even debatable which has been more important to music as an art form in the past 10 years.

Sounds like you're right. Radiohead songs make you think. I'm not against complicated songs that are hard to understand. I prefer simpler lyrics, tho. Here's where I differ (difer?): I, personally, don't care if a band has "been important to music as an art form" if I don't like their music. In other words, I don't like something because its original or artistic. I like music because I like it. Most of the time I can't even seperate out why exactly I like it, I just do.