The Continuing Adventures of the Pub

[Brenden]

Thanks!

Not sure what I think of the Jars album. Out Of My Hands didn't really impress me and so far they haven't changed my mind.

[bloop]

OK, I'm back, so the pub is back up.

[enemy anemone]

hm, I can't access it because the connection times out. I was interested in the Spanish guitar stuff.

also, would you delete my old stuff? thanks!

[bloop]

OK, I'll check into it. Maybe my daughter messed with it or something.

[murlough23]

OK, I'll check into it. Maybe my daughter messed with it or something.

Tell her to stop chewing through the wires.

[bloop]

OK, try it now. I goofed, so no blaming the daughter.  

[enemy anemone]

still no luck--it's probably something on my end if others are able to get in. thanks for checking though!

[bloop]

still no luck--it's probably something on my end if others are able to get in. thanks for checking though!

Can someone check this please?

[murlough23]

I can't get in either.

[bloop]

Huh. I'm not sure what the problem is, then. Before, it just wasn't sharing anything, but that's just because I moved a folder (which contained the file system) to a different drive. Now, I have that file system loaded up, and my tests from this computer seem to be working (but they only tell me so much).

The phub thing should still be working, but maybe you can try this out:
http://96.238.163.197:1015/

[murlough23]

The phub thing should still be working, but maybe you can try this out:
http://96.238.163.197:1015/

Nope. Still not working.

[bloop]

Ugh. OK, try again. Eventually, I should get it right.

[murlough23]

Ugh. OK, try again. Eventually, I should get it right.

That did it. Gratzi!

[enemy anemone]

yes! it worked for me, too! thanks!

[bloop]

Yeah, it was a port forwarding issue. I don't have any idea how it got screwed up, though.

Vlad, any time you want to take this thing over is fine with me.   

[bloop]

A far better-sounding Jars of Clay is up!

[bloop]

Phil Selway's rather understated very short album.

[bloop]

Ivoryline

[murlough23]

I haven't contributed anything in a great while, so here's what I've put up today for your sampling pleasure:

"Ain't No Son", Court Yard Hounds
A blistering country-rock song about... well, I'll let you figure out the subject matter. If the voices sound familiar, it's because this is the Dixie Chicks minus Natalie Maines.

"Bold and Underlined", Future of Forestry
A solid rocker from the final EP in the Travel trilogy; also an unfortunate example of how they overdid the compression a bit on this one.

"Love Is for the Middle Class", House of Heroes
For those who haven't gotten their feet wet with HoH. One of their most well-written tracks. It's true enough to hurt a little.

"American Clouds", Paper Route
A standout from the Are We All Forgotten EP that would have been good enough to save for the album if they'd gone that, um, route.

"Traveling Shoes", Robert Randolph & the Family Band
The scared steel stalwart's spin (ouch, alliteration!) on a field recording of an old spiritual.

"Bullets in the Air", The Reign of Kindo
I put up the original and the "8Bit Remix", just to illustrate the absurdity of reworking a frenetic jazz/rock song as a chiptune.

"Idioteque (live)", Vienna Teng & Alex Wong
Those interested in Vienna Teng, Radiohead, or both have probably already heard this, but I figured you'd want a good quality recording of it.

[bloop]

Put Kevin Max up if anyone is interested.

[bloop]

Put something up just for the lulz because, Lord knows, I could use it.  I think you can all figure out which it is.

[bloop]

Linked to some Grant Lee Buffalo and I'm working on the fantastic new Deerhunter.

The former is a 90s alt country band. For those a little put off by Tweedy's vocals, this may be much easier on the ears.

[murlough23]

Deerhunter

It just dawned on me that this and "The Dear Hunter" are two distinct bands.

[bloop]

I think you would like their new one, but I've been wrong about such things before. I'm more certain you would like GLB, but that's more a "Respect the Classics" band than something to put in the current digesting pile.

It's all up now, btw.

[bloop]

Sufjan! F-bombs! Huzzah!

(I don't want to make it sound like Limp Bizkit or anything, but he definitely put the f-word to some use on the penultimate track)

[murlough23]

Sufjan! F-bombs! Huzzah!

(I don't want to make it sound like Limp Bizkit or anything, but he definitely put the f-word to some use on the penultimate track)

That's disappointing. He's got a good enough vocabulary to not need this.

[bloop]

*sigh*

Saying the f-word is not an issue of vocabulary. If your vocabulary is limited to them (or limited in general, not just to the "bad word" list), then it is. Considering that it is one repeated line in one song, well, if he didn't know the word, he would have a smaller vocabulary than if he did.

The line sounds positively Radiohead-ish in its delivery to me, which is an oddity as Sufjan isn't known for his caterwaul. I like the song, though. It's the final, "naughty word"-free song that may take some wrapping my head around. Sufjan becomes T-Pain for a section there.

The album is bound to get its own thread eventually, so I might as well make one if it doesn't exist already.

[murlough23]

*sigh*

Saying the f-word is not an issue of vocabulary. If your vocabulary is limited to them (or limited in general, not just to the "bad word" list), then it is. Considering that it is one repeated line in one song, well, if he didn't know the word, he would have a smaller vocabulary than if he did.

It's not a matter of knowing it. It's a matter of whether a word which will quite likely limit the potential audience of song is really necessary for the song to get its point across. Maybe sometimes it is. But I have my doubts when I hear profanity used by an artist who has previously articulated himself quite well without it. It's not so much my personal reaction to it, as the fact that I'm thinking, "There goes another artists whose latest work I will have to give pause before sharing it with a bunch of my friends."

[bloop]

It's not profanity, but I suppose any further discussion belongs in the album's thread.

I'm neutral on using any word. Does it communicate what the artist is trying to communicate? If yes, then it's fine. If no, then he needs to choose his words better. The assessment has nothing to do with whether or not the word in question is on some ridiculous bourgeois cultural blacklist. If a listener doesn't listen to him because of that, the problem is the listener, not the artist.

Again, use or non-use says little about the artist's vocabulary. There are some tell-tale signs of limited mastery of the English language that has to do with overuse of stock phrases, sticking with simple sentence structures, redundancy and so forth, but that's about it.

[murlough23]

It's not profanity, but I suppose any further discussion belongs in the album's thread.

Profanity's more or less defined by what people consider profane. It changes over time. Some words acceptable today were not yesterday, and there's a spectrum of opinions, depending on who you talk to. When I'm with folks like the ones here at The Phorum, I know we're generally lax about language to the point where words that would otherwise need to be censored or avoided are permissible, so I don't mind 'em. Elsewhere, I try to watch it (and I get called on it by my wife if I don't). So I try to also be mindful of what words or subject matter will offend people when it comes to music or other entertainment choices that I recommend to them. It doesn't mean I'll summarily dismiss something, but it's a pain to have to start putting a caveat on it when I could previously recommend something without reservations.

I'm not saying Sufjan made a bad artistic choice or did something morally wrong. It just isn't my preference when it comes to music that I will listen to again and again (and I've clearly shown a willingness to work around this with a lot of other artists in the past). Just because I feel more liberated on a particular issue doesn't mean that I should disregard the sensibilities of others (or worse, dismiss them using straw man arguments).

[bloop]

Profanity's more or less defined by what people consider profane. It changes over time.

No, profanity has to do with profaning that which is sacred (blasphemy). Webster can accurately say what a word means to people, and it would take the broad approach here, but it gets actual meaning wrong at times (which lends itself to problems when discussing the morality of these things with people. Profanity is wrong. Saying "I'm not messing around" in a "colorful" way is not).

Anyway, just listen to the album. Even if you don't like its use there, I think you'll enjoy it as a whole.

[murlough23]

Fine. Swearing. My terminology is bad, but you know what I'm talking about here.

[bloop]

Fine. Swearing.

It's not that either.  

Yes, I know what you're talking about, but I believe in being very precise in the way I describe language because it leads to the moral confusion pervasive in Evangelical culture that I alluded to earlier.

[murlough23]

It's not that either.  

Yes, I know what you're talking about, but I believe in being very precise in the way I describe language because it leads to the moral confusion pervasive in Evangelical culture that I alluded to earlier.

I'm fine with using your preferred term, if pedantic is the way you wanna play this.

[bloop]

Didn't we have a thread about this somewhere? Maybe someone can do a merge or something.

(For the record, I don't think it's pedantic to want to get something like this right when people are wrongfully judged based on it)

[murlough23]

Didn't we have a thread about this somewhere? Maybe someone can do a merge or something.

(For the record, I don't think it's pedantic to want to get something like this right when people are wrongfully judged based on it)

How about less taunting and more helpful correction, if I am in fact so disdainfully wrong about this?

[bloop]

I'm not taunting you, but the word for what we're describing is "vulgarity". I just thought you had that figured out it all.

[murlough23]

Fine. I'm not a big fan of vulgarity in music. I respect that some others would rather not hear it in any context. And its use in music limits what music I can recommend to them. An acceptable audience limitation if the artist was always that way, but kind of a bummer for me if the artist was previously not vulgar in any way.

We could debate the meaning of "vulgar" forever, but within reason, I try to not put stuff in people's faces that they consider vulgar. Maybe I don't consider it vulgar, or at least, not offensively so. But I think there's value in respecting the boundaries of others here. (Not saying Sufjan or anyone else is disrespecting boundaries. The fact remains, he made a song my wife's not gonna enjoy listening to in the car with me.)

[bloop]

I'm a fan of good language in music, but I don't define it in the same way "polite" culture does.

[murlough23]

Put something up just for the lulz because, Lord knows, I could use it.  I think you can all figure out which it is.

So what do you think, bloop? Is Radiohead good make-out music?

(Just to clarify, that's a simple request for your opinion on the matter, not an invitation.)