mewithoutYou - "it's all crazy..."

[dgp11776]

Okay, so I think this album deserves its own thread.  And not just because it's my new #1.  I only had a passing interest in mewithoutYou before this album, but this one made me sit up.  I had always thought "what if they made an album without all of the yelling/shouting?"  Well, that's exactly what they did.  So if you've written them off due to prior albums, that would be a mistake.  Fans of Anathallo, Neutral Milk Hotel, and the Decemberists should find much to praise in this album.  For those that have heard it, sound off!

[Ian]

Also Joanna Newsom.

This is a great album for sure, I think it's their best one (although I'm sure plenty of long time fans will disagree).  Weiss is a terrific lyricist, might be my favorite, and he doesn't slouch on It's All Crazy.

[bloop]

I'm waiting for a high quality leak.  I already ordered the vinyl without even listening to it, which is rare for me.

[dgp11776]

I'm waiting for a high quality leak.  I already ordered the vinyl without even listening to it, which is rare for me.

Wow!  That's saying something.

Burnt Toast said they will be doing their best to have it ready by release date.  They were only off about a week or so on Starflyer 59's last album.

[Josh]

I'm a little surprised to see a quasi-Christian label release an album with a song called "Allah, Allah, Allah" on it! 

Daniel Smith's involvement with this makes me curious. Love me some Danielson.

[dgp11776]

I'm a little surprised to see a quasi-Christian label release an album with a song called "Allah, Allah, Allah" on it! 

Somewhere in the world, PaulDA is twitching.

[bloop]

"Allah, Allah, Allah" = God in three persons (roughly)?

If anything, that would offend Islamic people.

[murlough23]

Anyone who would write a song off by its title is a reactionary idiot. I'd need to see the lyrics in full before making a judgment call.

NP: "I Am a Stranger", The Welcome Wagon

[dgp11776]

In everywhere we look (x6)
Allah, Allah, Allah
In everywhere we look

In everyone we meet (x6)
Allah, Allah, Allah
In everyone we meet

In every blade of grass (x6)
Allah, Allah, Allah
In every blade of grass

It doesn't matter what you done
It doesn't matter what you done
What effect is without a cause?
It doesn't matter what you done
Now lay your faithless head down
In necessities cotton hand
There's a love that never changes
No matter what you done

If your old man did you wrong (x3)
Well maybe his old man did him wrong
If you care to sing forgiveness songs
Come down and join our band
We'll cut you like sword
And sing forgiveness songs

Everywhere we look (x5)
It's all crazy
It's all false
It's all a dream
It's alright
Everywhere we look

[murlough23]

OK, I'm stumped. Is there a bit of role playing going on here?

NP: "Adore Adore", Yoav

[dgp11776]

I haven't the foggiest.  It does seem to me, though, that the key messages of the song are an omnipresent God, a loving God, and a forgiving God.

[murlough23]

I haven't the foggiest.  It does seem to me, though, that the key messages of the song are an omnipresent God, a loving God, and a forgiving God.

Perhaps, but what's with "We'll cut you like sword" and the stuff about the sins of the fathers? Creepy.

NP: "Standing Up for Nothing", Caedmon's Call

[dgp11776]

I would think that the "old man doing us wrong" could refer to holding on to old grudges, etc. that leave us with an unforgiving spirit.  Cutting us like a sword (left the "a" out in the lyrics) makes me think of Hebrews 4:12, where we read the Word of God is like a two-edged sword.  Christ Himself commands us to forgive our debtors, so maybe that's a reference to the cutting words of Christ commanding us to forgive.

Obviously, I could be way off.

[murlough23]

Interesting. So is this using another culture/religion's word for God as an attempt to describe our own God in terms that are more comfortable to them, kind of like how P.O.D. or Christafari would use "Jah"?

[dgp11776]

I know that at least one of his parents come from a Muslim background, so that could definitely be the reasoning behind it.  I also know that, in concert, he has announced the name of the song as being "God, God, God."

On the same topic, along with "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For," it's one of the best three-cord songs I've ever heard.

[Ian]

I think Aaron himself his somewhere between a Christian and a Muslim (haven't read them myself, but I've heard he's expressed several doubts about the Christian faith in interviews).  He's used Arabic in several songs before, so it's probably pretty natural for him.  Plus it sounds a lot better to sing "Allah, Allah, Allah" than "God, God, God".

[ajyouthguy]

well here is what the all-important Wiki says about their faith, etc...

The Weiss brothers are of Jewish descent and their songs explore Judeo-Christian themes. The Weiss brothers were also raised in a Sufi household—their mother had converted from the Episcopal church, and their father from Judaism.[3] Due to the Christian themes of Aaron Weiss' lyrics, they have been categorized as a Christian band, although in interview, A. Weiss has stated he doesn't think they are a Christian band.[3] Their lyrics reflect a personal relationship with God, and are not evangelical. Other lyrical themes explored include suffering and self-doubt.

[ajyouthguy]

and here is part of an interview Aaron did with "Busted Halo":

Busted Halo: So, I was reading that your mother is Muslim and your dad is Jewish, right?

Aaron Weiss: Yeah, technically. But their beliefs are pretty similar. They both converted to the Sufi faith, which is Islamic mysticism. So my dad was raised Jewish and became Sufi, but he still identifies himself as a Jew. My mom was raised Episcopalian and she converted thoroughly to Sufi Islam.

BH: So were you raised under Sufi Islam then?

AW: Yeah, well, I was raised hearing the stories and seeing my mom pray, but they never made me go to the mosque or forced me to accept what they believe. They were pretty hands off. They did tell me about God and taught me how to pray, but it wasn’t regimented in any way.

“It’s not like I’m offended if someone says we’re a Christian band. I just don’t think it’s true. I don’t think we live up to that calling, so I’d be reluctant to go saying that, and God knows the truth.”

BH: So at what point did you come into contact with Christianity?

AW: I went to summer camp when I was younger, and I wasn’t interested in what they were talking about. It was Episcopalian, from my mom’s side of the family. They sent me there. I wasn’t hostile; I just didn’t care. Then, there was a sort of evangelical Christian organization in my high school called Young Light, and they’d take people out to movies and go to fast food restaurants. It was just more of a social club, and they tried to keep it wholesome. It wasn’t all about God. But then we went on a retreat and they started talking about God, like out in the woods, and I was like, “Wait a minute. What’s all this?” So around the end of high school is when I started attending a church and praying the language of Christianity. So, 11 years ago or so.

BH: What was your parents’ reaction to that?

AW: Oh…they didn’t seem too worried about it. They were glad that I believed in God. But it was kind of a fundamentalist church, so I had some warnings from my family, like, “Be careful of this spirit of self-righteousness.” They were sensing in me an arrogance that said, “Now I have the truth and you don’t. I’m going to tell you how it is.” Here I am 17-years-old and telling my parents, who are in their 40s, everything about God and the Creator, and the mysteries of the universe and stuff. It wasn’t long until I fell off of that high horse and realized that maybe I don’t know everything.

BH: Were there times when you butted heads with your parents?

AW: Oh, yeah, because I started trying to convert them, and they would try to convert me. So they’d be reading their books to me, and I’d be reading my books to them. It was like a religious war. We never yelled at each other, but we were constantly trying to change each other. It seemed like the wrong approach. So, a few years ago, I laid down my arms and realized that it was my duty to honor my parents not to argue with them.

[murlough23]

Wow. Good thing that family doesn't live in the Middle East, or they'd have all blown each other up by now.

[bloop]

It would be the best Christian release since Danielson's album, if it wasn't actually better.  I'm a bit taken aback, blown away, however you want to put it.  2009 might be one of the few years with two 10.0s.

[dgp11776]

So glad to read that! 

I also read on Burnt Toast that the 2XLP is going to be on colored vinyl.  Nice!

[bloop]

Aaron's voice reminds me of Conor Oberst in its more passionate, urgent moments.  At least for me, that's a good thing.

[Ian]

Good call, bloop; I haven't really thought about this album relative to other Christian releases, but I'm hard pressed to think of any that are definitively better than this.

[bloop]

I really like how Weiss is harnessing all the power of fable in many of these songs (i.e. my current pub song).  Just gorgeous.

[valleycat]

I didn't like Brother, Sister.  Will I like this?

I do like some of the artists compared, like Joanna Newsom and NMH.

[Ian]

It's All Crazy is an entirely different beast than Brother, Sister.  If you liked the spider songs at all though, you will probably like this.

[NinjaRob17]

Or if you liked "In A Sweater Poorly Knit".

[dgp11776]

I really like how Weiss is harnessing all the power of fable in many of these songs (i.e. my current pub song).  Just gorgeous.

I'm hoping that the album art latches onto this, because I love this aspect of the album as well.

[Ian]

[dgp11776]

I was referring to the album art beyond the cover.

[valleycat]

I just listened to it for the first time.  It's fantastic!  A lot like Neutral Milk Hotel, but...with Christian subject matter.  I wonder if any major review sites would review this, or if they'd treat it like Starflyer's latest/anything else from Tooth and Nail and not touch it with a ten foot pole for its obvious Christianity, unless to slam it for that. 

[bloop]

Personally, I think everyone ought to give it a chance.  I think there's some possibility that some will due to the connection with Danielson.

[Josh]

I haven't had a chance to hear it yet but I intend to, precisely because of the Danielson connection. (I LOVE Ships!)

[murlough23]

I just listened to it for the first time.  It's fantastic!  A lot like Neutral Milk Hotel, but...with Christian subject matter.  I wonder if any major review sites would review this, or if they'd treat it like Starflyer's latest/anything else from Tooth and Nail and not touch it with a ten foot pole for its obvious Christianity, unless to slam it for that. 

Obvious Christianity? On an album with a track called "Allah, Allah, Allah?"

That's not a knock, I'm just saying the association with Christian music is pretty obscure. Someone hearing of the band for the first time would have no reason to be aware of it at all. Tooth & Nail is the only real clue there, and that requires knowing something about the label (which has had plenty of other bands that doesn't necessarily identify as Christian - in their music or in the members' personal lives.)

[bloop]

At least one lyric that immediately comes to mind makes their affiliation with the Messiah pretty obvious, I think.  You'll know it when you hear it.

[Ian]

Obvious Christianity? On an album with a track called "Allah, Allah, Allah?"

That's not a knock, I'm just saying the association with Christian music is pretty obscure. Someone hearing of the band for the first time would have no reason to be aware of it at all. Tooth & Nail is the only real clue there, and that requires knowing something about the label (which has had plenty of other bands that doesn't necessarily identify as Christian - in their music or in the members' personal lives.)

I dunno... pretty much every message board topic on them I've ever read opens with "This album is great!" and is replied to with "Yeah but they're Christians so I'll probably skip it."  Plus there's the fact that they frequent Christian music festivals, and likely get most of their audience from youth groups and Christian indie people.  Bands like Switchfoot and Relient K (and maybe Mute Math is starting to do it, although they haven't quite broken free of the "yeah but they're christian" label yet), have an immediate enough sound and vague enough lyrics that they've been able to get radio play without people knowing what they're listening to.  mewithoutYou has neither of those things, which both makes them the superior band (combined with talent of course), but also far less marketable to non-Christians.

[bloop]

The topic on the Radiohead board is dominated by positive remarks about the album, as is the one on Head-Fi.  I think a fair amount of mainstream market penetration is possible here.

[murlough23]

I dunno... pretty much every message board topic on them I've ever read opens with "This album is great!" and is replied to with "Yeah but they're Christians so I'll probably skip it."

Doh! Looks like the jig is up.

But someone had to open that thread endorsing them... were the endorsers always Christians?

Plus there's the fact that they frequent Christian music festivals, and likely get most of their audience from youth groups and Christian indie people.  Bands like Switchfoot and Relient K (and maybe Mute Math is starting to do it, although they haven't quite broken free of the "yeah but they're christian" label yet), have an immediate enough sound and vague enough lyrics that they've been able to get radio play without people knowing what they're listening to.

I'd be much more likely to hear the "But they're a Christian band argument" about SF and RK. People seem to know where they came from; maybe it bugs them, maybe it doesn't, but I don't know of many fans of those bands who aren't aware. (In the case of Mute Math, I just haven't seen enough public response to them either way to know how they're being received).

mewithoutYou has neither of those things, which both makes them the superior band (combined with talent of course), but also far less marketable to non-Christians.

Having a less immediate sound just makes you less marketable, period. (That's not a criticism. I'm just saying that this is something the band has likely accepted.)

It's also worth noting that there may be plenty of Christians outside of the "CCM audience" who wouldn't listen to CCM but wouldn't reject a band solely on the basis of their lyrics sounding kinda sorta Christian.

[Ian]

The topic on the Radiohead board is dominated by positive remarks about the album, as is the one on Head-Fi.

Yeah... among the people who were willing to listen to it. (on atease that is, i don't know about head-fi)

I'd be much more likely to hear the "But they're a Christian band argument" about SF and RK. People seem to know where they came from; maybe it bugs them, maybe it doesn't, but I don't know of many fans of those bands who aren't aware. (In the case of Mute Math, I just haven't seen enough public response to them either way to know how they're being received).

I guess we must frequent different music sites, but nearly every article on MM I read is headed up with "Well these guys are Christians but believe it or not they seem pretty talented!"

[murlough23]

Yeah... among the people who were willing to listen to it. (on atease that is, i don't know about head-fi)
I guess we must frequent different music sites, but nearly every article on MM I read is headed up with "Well these guys are Christians but believe it or not they seem pretty talented!"

It is my mission to see that one day, "Christian" and "talented" will not be commonly assumed to be mutually exclusive descriptors.